Voter Fraud – A Clear and Present Danger.

Like the title?

 

It’s both a homage to Jack Ryan and Dirty Sex & Politics, who

 

mentioned this particular film/book in her post “Self-Manipulation” yesterday. Granted, my post has nothing to do with her topic in that post, but still…

It makes me think of Harrison Ford anyway…and that’s always of the good.

I had a conversation on facebook today with a friend who is substantially more liberal than I am. We usually don’t discuss politics, because it’s not a healthy conversation for us to have. We were discussing whether or not it is reasonable to insist the those who vote or register to vote, do so with a valid government issued ID.

Not surprisingly I was on the side that, yes this is reasonable and legal, she was not.

The articles that sparked this conversation? Two opinion pieces (and hatchet jobs) from the New York Times. I put opinion in bold, because the people in question the conversation seemed to think that these articles are sufficient proof that A.) Voter fraud does not exist and B.) that requiring voters to show a government ID is all part of a vast Republican conspiracy to “restrict the voting rights of demographic groups that tend to vote Democratic. Blacks, Hispanics, the poor and the young, who are more likely to support President Obama, are disproportionately represented in the 21 million people without government IDs.”

First, I would like to know why I, as a registered Republican, have never been invited to the meetings where we decide on these vast Republican conspiracies.

Secondly, if I brought up something said by Glenn Beck or Bill O’Reilly as proof in a debate with a liberal I would be promptly chastised for using opinions rather than facts. Yet when the NYT write hatchet job opinion pieces, those are completely valid as proof on the  liberal side.

Yeah, that makes sense.

Let’s move on to the topic of government IDs to vote.

The arguments put forward about why requiring a government ID is unreasonable (from my friend) are as follows.

1.) If you have to take the bus (which is probable if you don’t have a driver’s license already) they are unreliable and take a long time to get there.

My response: Instant gratification usually doesn’t exist. Anything worth having is probably going to take a little effort. and OH BOO HOO YOU POOR BABIES! I don’t have a car, I go to school on the train every morning. It’s not convenient, but I do it. When I lived on my own I went to the grocery store on a bus on my day off and rode back with 5 or 6 bags of groceries.

2.) The wait at the DMV takes to long and takes away time from classes or working.

My Response:  Last time I went (to get a learner’s permit) I was there for about 2 hours. I’ve waited in lines at Disney Land that were longer than that. As for the second part, this is why you learn to budget your time. If you feel that getting an ID is important enough, you will take the time to get one. The time isn’t actually that much. Let’s assume 3 hours at the DMV (time in which you can use these things called ‘textbooks’ to study while you wait, so you aren’t hurting your education) and another 2 hours for bus rides (with the number of DMVs in my city, I doubt it would take much longer to travel both ways to the closest one). That means 5 hours, of which at least 4 hours can be used studying, spent getting an ID. College students, the ones I know as well as myself, spend more time than that each week watching TV. They can find the time to go to get an ID, even if it isn’t convenient.

3.) Asking friends for a ride is embarrassing or people aren’t a “fan” of doing it.

My response: Get over it. If you need a ride then ask for it. Sure it embarrasses me to ask for a ride from friends and I tend to avoid it if possible, but if I need a ride I ask for it. Embarrassment is not a good excuse in this case, just like being embarrassed wouldn’t be a good excuse for not telling your doctor about a health issue. If it has to be done, then you do it.

The supreme court supported the concept of Voter IDs, and Justice Stevens (one of the most liberal judges on the court) was the one who wrote the opinion supporting it.

Jimmy Carter is also in favor of Voter IDs.

Both of these sort of blow the idea that this is a Republican plot out of the water. You don’t see the New York Times reporting on that though, do you?

Just a thought.

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Of course none of this takes into account that, if you are over 18 and a college student and you don’t have a state ID, you are simply too dumb to live.

I’m sorry if that’s offensive, but it’s true.

Even if you don’t drive, having a state-issued ID card is a fairly important thing.

Let me tell you a few things that I’ve done in the past couple of years that I couldn’t have done if I weren’t in possession of my Arizona state photo identification card.

1.) Flown to Atlanta for Dragon-Con

You need a valid government issued ID to get on a plane if you are not a minor.

2.) Bought things with my credit card

I will admit that quite a few places do not ask for ID when you make a credit/debit card purchase. This is not legal and could get the business into quite a bit of trouble. With debit it’s a bit more permissible, since you need to know the PIN#, but any credit transaction should ask for an ID.

3.) Get a job

When you are filling out paperwork for a job you need a photo identification card to prove that you are who you say you are and that you are an United States citizen. I used my passport for my last job, but let me tell you…getting a passport is a hell of a lot hard than getting a state ID card.

4.) Get an apartment (in a low income housing development, I might add)

To even go on a walk through of the complex they needed to photocopy my state photo ID. They had a copy in my file and they used the information on it and on my application to run a background check on me. That was the same at every apartment complex that I visited when I was looking for an apartment in 2010.

5.) Get a bank account/replace debit card

When I opened my bank account they scanned in my ID. When I lost my debit card several months ago, I had to show them my ID to get a new one and receive a temporary replacement ATM card…even though I knew all the passwords and information for my account.

6.) Go to a bar

They aren’t going to simply take your word that you are 21. Granted I have used my passport for this as well at one point, but see #3 about that.

 

Outside of the things I just mentioned, that have happened to me. There are of course numerous other things you can’t do without a state ID. You can’t buy cigarettes, pick up tickets from will-call, buy alcohol at the grocery store, apply for a credit card, write checks, or get a library card if you are 18+.

Probably several other things as well, that I can’t think of right now.

Is it wrong to force people to get an ID to do any of the above? I don’t believe so, neither do most of you as far as I can tell. If you do, why?

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Now for voter fraud.

When I brought up the fact that not requiring people to use a government approved ID when voting would make it far easier to commit voter fraud, my friend responded “You /seriously/ think it’ll go all slippery slope into extreme voter fraud?”

Umm…no. A Slippery Slope fallacy argument would be “There is no such thing as voter fraud now, but if you allow voting without a state ID then voter fraud will suddenly start to happen.”

My argument is that, regardless of what the New York Times claims, voter fraud does exist and there is not reason to make it easier to commit by not using state issued ID for voting. That is not a slippery slope.

For stories of actual voter fraud occurring, here are a few links.

4 NY Democrats Plead Guilty to Voter Fraud

Article about ACORN and NYT articles being biased

We Will Not Be Silenced a film produced by a democrat activist talking about voter fraud in the Democratic party.

And even the case mentioned in the NYT article, of parents voting for their children while they are away at college, is voter fraud, even if the NYT tried to play it down. Voting for someone who is not yourself and forging their signature on an absentee ballot is illegal! Students who are registered in a different state, such as if a student at my college was from Iowa and registered to vote there, can still vote through absentee ballots than can be mailed out of state…or even to other countries if they are studying abroad. In 2008 my brother was teaching in Japan and he had the option, though I don’t think he used it, to get an absentee ballot sent to him and vote in Arizona while he was working in Japan.

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These new laws are perfectly reasonable, the Supreme court is in favor of them, and they do not prevent anyone who is really interested in voting from doing so…unless they are not in the country legally, in which case they should not be voting.

Somehow I think that the string pullers in the Democratic party a little more worried about losing the illegal immigrant vote, than they are the ‘broke college student’ vote.

For the record, I sincerely believe that if you are have gone to the trouble to be a well educated and well informed adult about the election, then you are going to go to the effort of getting a state ID so that you can vote. And you if aren’t willing to go to through the, extremely small, task of going to an ID…well you probably aren’t that invested in the democratic process and probably aren’t very informed in the first place. In which case, good riddance, we don’t need you voting.

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8 Comments

  1. God I love that movie! Hahaha!!

    I have to say this topic is mind blowing to me. I think because it’s arguing against common sense. (Place head rapidly against brick wall) Every single argument you made here for showing ID’s is spot on!!! It’s just flat out STUPID that an ID wouldn’t be required.
    Why does the left continue to insist that people be held accountable for nothing? Oh yeah, cuz they’d lose!

    • The left holds no one accountable because they want people to remain children, dependent on their nanny government, to take care of them and solve all their problems. It’s as easy as that. Conservatives want people to grow up and become adults.

      I’m glad you think I’m spot on, I highly doubt any liberals will agree. I think I might have tweaked a few people by telling them that I don’t care about their laziness and apathy and by telling them that they were too stupid to live.
      Sometimes I think I may be too confrontational…but then I realize that as long as I have fun writing it, it doesn’t really matter, lol.

  2. I did not know that Jimmy Carter was in favor of voter ID. That little factoid might just make me feel a twinge of “like” for the man.

    Aaaaand…there it went. Twinge is gone.

  3. Pingback: 10th Amendment? What’s that? « The Snark Who Hunts Back

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